Topic: Dreamsuite-ing

Let's say you were in a situation where money was almost no object.  You have the opportunity to spend money towards building a graphics software suite.  There are not enough funds to buy Adobe or buy Canva but otherwise the money is almost no object.

So, what would you do?

Would you throw that money behind open source projects, either existing ones like Scribus, Inkscape and GIMP or new ones, which could possibly be forks of other open source projects such as the aforementioned.

Or would you throw that money behind a commercial project?  Would you start new?  Would you buy a company that already has something?  Would you offer subscriptions or perpetual licenses?  Would you price your apps at 99 cents, 9.99, 99.99 or 999.99?

What features would you make sure the software has?

What would you do?

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

For me, I'd be torn between giving money towards an open source project vs. building a commercial product.

You could have stipulations attached.  Like maybe you approach the Scribus people and say, you need a better UI (which they are working on) and I want INDD import, here's $500,000 to make it happen.  Could also make it incentive-based.  $250,000 now and $250,000 if they succeed.

On the other hand, again with funding being almost no object, you could start small and build up.  Start with a "lite" app that has some cool features people really want but isn't readily available, and give it a lot of export options so it can be used with Illustrator, Designer, CorelDraw, whatever.  Then just build and build on it, hopefully, until you have a full-featured illustration app.

Or buy a number of small companies with existing apps and put money into merging or expanding those apps and build on that.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

If I went the commercial route, the "power play" if you had the money would be to buy Quark.  When Adobe switched to subscriptions only, I think Quark was in the best position to take advantage of that.  And they tried.  Sorta.  But Quark seems to have this habit of shooting itself in the foot.  And then they seem to have this arrogance about them, like they haven't realized InDesign dethroned QuarkXPress years ago.  So, if you had the money, the thing to do would be to buy the company and get them in line.

But, I don't know that I would even try that.  You'd probably have to change the corporate culture there and that might be a big challenge if they haven't changed by now.

Instead, there are about four or five companies I would buy.  I'm not going to name them because, on the 0.01% chance I'd ever actually have this opportunity, I want to keep my options open.  They are all small companies.  One has a page layout program.  It's only been sporadically updated in the past decade or more, so it would need to be updated.  But, if I had the chance and had the money, I mean, I'd buy the company today and worry about finding programmers to update it later.  It has a small--probably very small--user base so there's that.  Also has a good history and a good name.  So lots to build off of.  Then there is another small company with a vector illustration program and another with an image editor.  The vector illustration program hasn't been updated for a few years but the graphics editor is regularly updated.  Also, there is another company with an app that has vector drawing features and that app is regularly updated.  So that would be another option for an illustration program.  So, all that provides a starting base.  You'd have a page layout program along the lines of InDesign/Publisher, an illustration program like Illustrator/Designer and a graphics editor like Photoshop/Photo.

Then the work would be in updating them and getting them to work together so you can have a seamless graphics suite.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Within the boundary conditions of this speculation, if I had this opportunity.

The software would be for sale yet there would be a fully functional unlimited duration trial. That way I would not be contributing to the digital divide.

The programs would be produced by, for each feature as it is introduced, writing the documentation and then have programmers produce software that implements the features as specified in the documentation.

There would be a television prigramme series centred around a (fictional) design studio and printshop. Each episode an issue would arise and it would be dealt with, the programmes mixing education with entertainment. There would be continuing characters.

For example, the first episode would start in a café, there is going to be a live music evening, and some posters are required. It emerges that the music group are from Sweden and there is an accented character in the name of the group. And in the names of some of the members of the group. The script is written so that all of the accented characters needed for Swedish are included. Then at the printshop, there is discussion of how to insert accented characters into a document as they are not on the keyboard, and it is shown being done on a screen, slowly and gently, that is important.  Later the finished posters are shown, first in the printshop, then later in use in the café. The episode ends with a performance by the group, which is in fact a performance by actors and session musicians, though shown in full, not talked over or showing people watching while the performance is taking place.

Each episode of the programme having a different issue. For example, the local art gallery wants some trifold leaflets for an exhibition. For example, someone wants her handwritten poem typeset and printed and framed. For example, a local startup wants a logo for its product designed.

The television programmes are available on free-to-air television channels and on the web.

Revenue is from advertising revenue and sale of merchandise.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

William wrote:

The software would be for sale yet there would be a fully functional unlimited duration trial.

What incentive would there be for users to make a purchase? You might as well simply encourage donations while offering the software as a free product.

William wrote:

Then at the printshop, there is discussion of how to insert accented characters into a document as they are not on the keyboard, and it is shown being done on a screen, slowly and gently, that is important.

Insertion of accented characters is fairly standard. On macOS and iPadOS (as on iOS on iPhone) accented characters are readily available via the keyboard, and even Windoze has the option of Alt sequences using the numeric keypad. There are also websites such as TypeIt.org.

I can see the importance of doing it slowly so that the viewer can follow what is happening, but I’m afraid I don’t see the relevance of doing it gently.

William wrote:

Each episode of the programme having a different issue.

I think you mean highlighting or discussing a different issue! Having an issue implies encountering problems.

“Welcome to the present moment. Here. Now. The only moment there ever is.”
― Eckhart Tolle

6 (edited by William 2025-10-12 11:13:33)

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Alfred wrote:
William wrote:

The software would be for sale yet there would be a fully functional unlimited duration trial.

What incentive would there be for users to make a purchase? You might as well simply encourage donations while offering the software as a free product.

Because some, maybe many, businesses want to use purchased, formally licensed for money software. Also, they can often do a purcahse order far more easily than make a donation.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Alfred wrote:

Insertion of accented characters is fairly standard. On macOS and iPadOS (as on iOS on iPhone) accented characters are readily available via the keyboard, and even Windoze has the option of Alt sequences using the numeric keypad. There are also websites such as TypeIt.org.

I used that as an example.

Continuing, Alfred wrote:

I can see the importance of doing it slowly so that the viewer can follow what is happening, but I’m afraid I don’t see the relevance of doing it gently.

As if teaching someone who is learning rather than as if answering a question from an examiner who already knows the answer to show that one knows how to do it.

William wrote:

Each episode of the programme having a different issue.

Alfred wrote:

I think you mean highlighting or discussing a different issue! Having an issue implies encountering problems.

Thank you.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

William wrote:

I used that as an example.

An example of what? https://punster.me/images/unsure.gif

Alfred wrote:

I can see the importance of doing it slowly so that the viewer can follow what is happening, but I’m afraid I don’t see the relevance of doing it gently.

William wrote:

As if teaching someone who is learning rather than as if answering a question from an examiner who already knows the answer to show that one knows how to do it.

That’s slowly/thoroughly, isn’t it? Perhaps you and I don’t always use the word ‘gently’ in quite the same way.

“Welcome to the present moment. Here. Now. The only moment there ever is.”
― Eckhart Tolle

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Maarten wrote:

Interesting topic. I would without a doubt invest in a new product to be built up from the ground.

In my experience when starting fresh with knowledge of the past you get way cleaner, faster performing and more intuitive product.

The devs at Serif obviously had algorithms that they could recycle from their (Windows-only) ‘Plus’ applications, but the Affinity suite was built from scratch and designed from the beginning to be ‘platform agnostic’ with core code shared across the range. PagePlus could use native files from its stablemate PhotoPlus (an image editor) but apart from that and the homegrown Serif Metafile Format (*.smf) that all recent versions of those applications could use, there wasn’t any provision for direct data exchange.

“Welcome to the present moment. Here. Now. The only moment there ever is.”
― Eckhart Tolle

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Alfred wrote:
William wrote:

I used that as an example.

An example of what? https://punster.me/images/unsure.gif

An example of a topic about using a graphics design program that could be used in an episode of the television programme.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Alfred wrote:

I can see the importance of doing it slowly so that the viewer can follow what is happening, but I’m afraid I don’t see the relevance of doing it gently.

William wrote:

As if teaching someone who is learning rather than as if answering a question from an examiner who already knows the answer to show that one knows how to do it.

That’s slowly/thoroughly, isn’t it? Perhaps you and I don’t always use the word ‘gently’ in quite the same way.

That is possible.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Maarten wrote:

I've never worked with their former products, but I'm sure that if they would've continued building upon that they would never be this successful now and would have many of the same issues Adobe still has: legacy UI and legacy code.

Exactly! The ‘Plus’ applications were quite heavily dependent on built-in Windows features, and they were becoming increasingly difficult to maintain and develop. The cross-platform thing that Affinity brought to the table was a particularly smart move: they actually launched the Mac version first, which obviously appealed to the many designers who use Macs rather than Windows machines.

“Welcome to the present moment. Here. Now. The only moment there ever is.”
― Eckhart Tolle

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Twolane wrote:

The cross-platform thing that Affinity brought to the table

I can't even imagine the coding nightmare that must have been.

I don’t think it can have been as much of a nightmare as you imagine! The desktop apps have a shared base of core code with a platform-specific UI layer on top.

I seem to remember Objective-C and C++ being mentioned by posts from Serif staff members on the official forums, so there’s probably nothing too esoteric.

“Welcome to the present moment. Here. Now. The only moment there ever is.”
― Eckhart Tolle

14

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

I like the television program idea.  It would have to focus on entertainment first, so people would watch it.  You'd want it to promote the applications, but you wouldn't want it to be a half hour commercial.  I wouldn't use it as a training program either.  Just demonstrate that the apps can do certain things so people are aware of the capabilities, then be sure to have documentation or videos available online for users that want to learn how to use those features.  The show would need to be entertaining and focus on that, with promoting the apps a secondary but important focus.

On open source, yes, I agree with a lot of the downsides.  The upside is that if a particular open source app does what you need, you can use it as long as you have a machine it runs on.  No Internet activation schemes, no subscriptions, nothing.  If a computer crashes, you will still be able to install and use the software if you have a compatible machine.  You won't have to worry about activation servers or logins or even where you saved the license key.

15

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

There is one subscription model I do like.  Not many software companies do it, but a few do.  That is where you end up with a perpetual license to the last version of the software you had before your subscription lapsed.  And if implemented without Internet activation, all the better.

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Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Maarten wrote:

Embergen, for example, which is a tool to have real time fire and smoke simulations in the viewport, did something nobody expected was possible. And for that they explicitely hired professionals NOT working in the field of VFX, because they would be rusted in their old habbits. They now are the biggest innovators in that field other companies are looking at. And used by most game studios and even the movie scene started using it.

You're lucky they don't have a Mac version otherwise curses would be upon you for making me buy another app.

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

dcr wrote:

You're lucky they don't have a Mac version otherwise curses would be upon you for making me buy another app.

https://punster.me/images/rotfl.gif

“Welcome to the present moment. Here. Now. The only moment there ever is.”
― Eckhart Tolle

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Maarten wrote:

. And Linux being the only valid non-American alternative to the major OSses.

Linus did Linux in 1991/2 and by 1996 was living in the US and has been there since which is where the main FOSS development organisations and companies are based.

If there was any doubt in 2024 Linux excluded Russian developers from working on the kernel on the instruction of the US government.
Linux is a US controlled OS.

The US Spooks don't like it when other governments put things in Linux but to be fair it has been open season on Linux for the last couple of decades.
At least with MS and Apple you know who is screwing you.

www.JAmedia.uk, primarily an Affinity Publisher V2 user for books and magazines.
[ Win 11 home | AMD Ryzen 5950X 16 Core CPU ]
[128GB Ram | NVIDIA 3080TI 2GB | MB ASUS ProArt B550| ]

19

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Maarten wrote:

Haha, well version 2.0 which is a complete rewrite and will come in 2026 IS available for MacOS too, so guess I'm to blame still (source: https://www.cgchannel.com/2025/01/check … rgen-2-0/) .

I can't hear you.  La la la la la la la . . .

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Re: Dreamsuite-ing

Maarten wrote:

Also quite refreshing that sometimes there's also creative software not yet running on MacOS! smile

The reason I switched to Moho was because Reallusion stopped making Mac versions so I had to switch from Cartoon Animator to something else.

21

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

On the topic of operating systems, many many years ago I read that any first year programmer should be able to write their own operating system.  That was enough motivation for me.  I already had in mind to create one and had ideas for it, so if any first year programmer should be able to do it, I was confident I could figure it out.  Forget Windows or Mac or Linux--I'd have my own!

I managed to crash the PC with my first line of code.

That was pretty much as far as I got.

22

Re: Dreamsuite-ing

As far as features go, one feature I would like, to the extent that it was feasible and legally permissible to do, is to have the software be the Swiss Army knife of opening files.  In the page layout program, for example, it would be nice for it to be able to open IDML files and even INDD files, as well as Affinity Publisher files.  Heck, if you have an old file on a floppy disk with a PageMaker 2 file, if you can find a way to get that file on your modern computer, the software should be able to import that as well.  Scribus files?  Check.  Quark?  Check.  Files from some obscure desktop publishing program from 1998 that only thirty-five people worldwide still use?  Check.  Again, you'd be limited to whatever could be legally and feasibly reverse-engineered or figured out from any publicly available documentation and so on.  But it would be nice to offer users a wide-range of options so that, whatever page layout (or illustration or photo editing) software they may be switching from, they'd have a chance of opening and using their old files.